# End-User Q&A Series: Migrating to OTel at Lightstep LLMS index: [llms.txt](/llms.txt) --- With contributions from [Adriana Villela](https://github.com/avillela) (Lightstep from ServiceNow). For the OpenTelemetry (OTel) End User Working Group's fourth [End User Q&A session](/community/end-user/interviews-feedback/) of 2023, we spoke with [Jacob Aronoff](https://www.linkedin.com/in/jaronoff97), Staff Software Engineer at [Lightstep from ServiceNow](https://lightstep.com/) and an OpenTelemetry Operator Maintainer. Read on if you are interested in learning how a vendor is using OTel in-house! This series of interviews is a monthly casual discussion with a team that's using OpenTelemetry in production. The goal is to share with the community what we've learned about how they are doing this, along with their successes and challenges, so that we can help improve OpenTelemetry together. ## Overview In this session, Jacob shared: - How he approached migrating to OpenTelemetry from OpenTracing and OpenCensus - What the [`TargetAllocator`](https://github.com/open-telemetry/opentelemetry-operator/blob/ac5bae83adb06d320b49239cec50469c0db784df/cmd/otel-allocator/README.md?from_branch=main) is, and how he's using it today - Why you might not want to deploy your Collector as a sidecar ## The interview ### The backstory Jacob has been on the Telemetry Pipeline Team at Lightstep from ServiceNow for almost two years now. He spent the first year solely focused on OTel migrations, internally as well as making it easier for their customers. When he joined the team, he says "we were still on OpenTracing for tracing, and a mix of OpenCensus and some hand-rolled Statsd stuff for metrics." This meant they had to run a proxy on every single Kubernetes pod (where a proxy sits as a sidecar on every pod, which means that you have to run another application that's going to read from [Statsd](https://github.com/statsd/statsd) and then forward the metrics). This was around the time OpenTelemetry metrics release candidates were just announced, and he saw it as an opportunity: "We have an internal OTel team that has been working on it a lot and wanted some immediate feedback on how to improve it, so I spun the migration for us," he says. ### The OpenCensus metrics migration Having done similar migrations previously, he initially planned it to be as safe as possible. They could have done it all in one go since they were in a monorepo, but that would have risked a bug being pushed up. Jacob says, "This is app data which we use for alerting to understand how our workloads are functioning in all of our environments, so it's important to not take that down since it’d be disastrous. Same story for users, they want to know if they move to OTel they won’t lose their alerting capabilities. You want a safe and easy migration." His team did the feature flag-based part of the configuration in Kubernetes. He says, "It would disable the sidecar and enable some code that would then swap the OTel for metrics and forward it to where it’s supposed to go. So that was the path there." However, along the way, he noticed some "pretty large performance issues" as he tested it in the environment they use to monitor their public environment. He worked with the OTel team to alleviate some of these concerns, and found that one of the big blockers was their heavy use of attributes on metrics. "It was tedious to go in and figure out which metrics are using them and getting rid of them. I had a theory that one codepath was the problem, where we’re doing the conversion from our internal tagging implementation to OTel tags, which came with a lot of other logic and [is] expensive to do, and it was on almost every call," he says. "No better time than now to begin another migration from OpenCensus to OTel." He saw this as another opportunity: "While we wait for the OTel folks on the metrics side to push out more performant code and implementations, we could also test out the theory of, if we migrate to OTel entirely, we’re going to see more performance benefits." Thus, they paused the metrics work and began on migrating their tracing. ### The OpenTracing migration For tracing, Jacob decided to try the "all-or-nothing approach." The path from OpenTracing to OTel was better known, with some documentation and examples they could refer to. Additionally, "they are backwards-compatible, you are able to use them in conjunction with each other," he says, "as long as you have propagators set up correctly." After setting up the propagators correctly, they made sure all their plugins (which are now open source) worked. They had to revert a few times from their staging environment, but didn't encounter any major problems aside from a bug that he missed. "I had to implement a custom sampler, which is ten times easier with OTel than it was with OpenTracing," he says. "I was able to get rid of a thousand lines of code and some dangerous hacks, so that was a really good thing." ### How to start a migration "I started with really small services my team owned with really low traffic, but enough for it to be constant," Jacob says. "The reason you want to pick a service like this is that if it's too low traffic, like one request every 10 minutes, you have to worry about sample rates, [and] you may not have a lot of data to compare against – that’s the big thing: you need to have some data to compare against." He had written a script early on for their metrics migration that queried different build tags that were on all their metrics. If the standard deviation for the newer build tag is greater than 1 compared to the previous release, that could signal an issue with your instrumentation library. "Another thing I had to check was that all the attributes were still present before and after migration, which is another thing that matters," Jacob notes. Sometimes they weren't, as in the case of Statsd automatically adding something they didn't care about; those could be safely ignored. For tracing, Jacob says, "I picked a service that had both internal-only traces (stayed within a single service) and traces that spanned multiple services with different types of instrumentation, so from Envoy to OTel to OpenTracing." He explains, "What you want to see is that the trace before has the same structure as the trace after. So I made another script that checked that those structures were relatively the same and that they all had the same attributes as well... That’s the point of the tracing migration – what matters is that all the attributes stayed the same." ### When data goes missing "The ‘why it’s missing’ stories are the really complicated ones," says Jacob. Sometimes, it's as simple as forgetting "to add something somewhere," but other times, there could be an upstream library that doesn't emit what you expected for OTel. He tells a story about the time he migrated their gRPC util package (which is now in Go contrib) and found an issue with propagation. "I was trying to understand what’s going wrong here. When I looked at the code – this tells you how early I was doing this migration – where there was supposed to be a propagator, there was just a 'TODO'," he shares. "It just took down our entire services’ traces in staging." He spent some time working on it, but they in turn were waiting on something else, and so on and so forth -- Jacob says there are "endless cycles of that type of thing." Once he resolved the problem, he upstreamed it so that it was available to the community. "A lot of the metrics work resulted in big performance boosts for OTel metrics," he says. "Like OTel Go metrics. It also has given the Statsd folks some ideas about how descriptive the API should be for various features. So things like Views and the use of Views is something we used heavily early in the migration." ### Metrics Views "A Metrics View is something that is run inside of your Meter Provider in OTel," Jacob explains. There are many configuration options, such as dropping attributes, which is one of the most common use cases. "For example, you’re a centralized SRE and you don't want anyone to instrument code with any user ID attribute, because that’s a high cardinality thing and it’s going to explode your metrics cost. You can make a View that gets added to your instrumentation and tell it to not record it, to deny it." There are also more advanced use cases, for example, dynamically changing the temporality or aggregation of your metrics. Temporality refers to whether a metric incorporates the previous measurement or not (cumulative and delta), and aggregation refers to how you send off the metrics. "It’s most useful for [our] histograms," says Jacob. "When you record histograms, there are a few different kinds – DataDog and Statsd histograms are not true histograms because what they’re recording is like aggregation samples. They give you a min, max, count, average, and P95 or something. The problem with that is, in distributed computing, if you have multiple applications that are reporting a P95, there’s no way you can get a true P95 from that observation with that aggregation," he continues. "The reason for that is, if you have five P95 observations, there’s not an aggregation to say, give me the overall P95 from that. You need to have something about the original data to recalculate it. You can get the average of the P95s but it’s not a great metric, it doesn't really tell you much. It's not really accurate. If you’re going to alert on something and page someone at night, you should be paging on accurate measurements." Initially, they did have a few people who relied on the min, max, sum, count instrument, so they used the View in the Metrics SDK to configure custom aggregation or histograms to emit a distribution, or, in OpenTelemetry, an exponential histogram. "We were dual emitting; this worked because they were different metric names, so there was no overlap." After they completed the migration, they were able to go back to any dashboard or alert that was using min, max, sum, count and change it to a distribution instead. "And because we had enough data in the past few weeks, months of running OTel metrics in our public env, that was possible to do," says Jacob. "That was one of the key features, because we had it, it was ten times easier and we were able to do it from the application, we didn't have to introduce any other components, which was really neat." ### Logs and span events When Jacob started the OTel migration, it was still too early for logs. "The thing we would change," he says, "is how we collect those logs, potentially; we previously did it using Google’s log agent, basically running [fluentbit](https://fluentbit.io) on every node in a GKE cluster and then they send it off to GCP and we tail it there." He notes that there may have been recent changes to this that he's not aware of at this time. "For a long time, we’ve used span events and logs for a lot of things internally," he says. "I’m a big fan of them." He is not as big a fan of logging, sharing that he thinks they are "cumbersome and expensive." He suggests that users opt for tracing and trace logs whenever possible, although he does like logging for local development, and tracing for distributed development." ### Telemetry collection in Kubernetes Kubernetes now has the ability to emit OTel traces natively, and Jacob is interested in seeing if the traces they get from those are sufficient for generating better Kubernetes metrics using the [spanmetrics processor](https://github.com/open-telemetry/opentelemetry-collector-contrib/tree/b01fd364d01962e666dc347eb13421053ea93bac/processor/spanmetricsprocessor?from_branch=main). > **NOTE:** The spanmetrics processor is deprecated, and the > [spanmetrics connector](https://github.com/open-telemetry/opentelemetry-collector-contrib/tree/b01fd364d01962e666dc347eb13421053ea93bac/processor/spanmetricsprocessor?from_branch=main) > should be used instead. "I'm very focused on infrastructure metrics, like Kubernetes infrastructure metrics, and I find them to be very painful in their current form," he says. Currently, he is using the Prometheus APIs to collect them, which is the ubiquitous way in the observability community since Kubernetes already emits these natively. "That's what we do right now, and I use an OTel component that I work on called the Target Allocator to distribute those targets, which is a pretty efficient way of getting all that data," says Jacob. "We also use [daemonsets](https://kubernetes.io/docs/concepts/workloads/controllers/daemonset/) that we run in our clusters to get that data in addition, so that works pretty effectively. The thing that's frustrating is just Prometheus. Prometheus scrape values can be a super common problem and it gets really annoying when you have to worry about metrics cardinality as well because it can explode." ### The Target Allocator "The Target Allocator is a component that's part of the [Kubernetes operator in OTel](https://github.com/open-telemetry/opentelemetry-operator) that does something that Prometheus can't do, which is: dynamically shard targets amongst a pool of scrapers," shares Jacob. Using the Target Allocator does not require running a Prometheus instance; however, Prometheus CRDs need to exist in order for the Target Allocator to pick them up. From the [docs](https://github.com/open-telemetry/opentelemetry-operator/tree/de81a64ae8d7d2f4f48945049d8ef9ad3509f89e/cmd/otel-allocator?from_branch=main#prometheuscr-specifics): > The Prometheus CRDs also have to exist for the Allocator to pick them up. The > best place to get them is from prometheus-operator: > [Releases](https://github.com/prometheus-operator/prometheus-operator/releases). > Only the CRDs for CRs that the Allocator watches for need to be deployed. They > can be picked out from the bundle.yaml file. He goes on to explain that while Prometheus has some experimental function for [sharding](https://www.techtarget.com/searchoracle/definition/sharding), you still have a problem for querying, since Prometheus is also a database and not just a scraper. You have to do some amount of coordination within these Prometheus instances, which can get expensive, or use a Prometheus scaling solution such as [Thanos](https://github.com/thanos-io/thanos#) or [Cortex](https://cortexmetrics.io) -- however, this would involve running more components that you'll need to monitor. "In OTel, we tack on this [Prometheus receiver](https://github.com/open-telemetry/opentelemetry-collector-contrib/blob/c9585747e97d1ba5a0aae3bee72eaf76438951f4/receiver/prometheusreceiver/README.md?from_branch=main) to get all this data, but because we want to be more efficient than Prometheus, because we don’t need to store the data, we have this component called the Target Allocator, which goes to do the service discovery from Prometheus," says Jacob. "It says give me all the targets I need to scrape. Then the Target Allocator says: with these targets, distribute them evenly among the set of collectors that’s running." That's the main thing this component does, and it also helps with job discovery. If you're using Prometheus service monitors, which is part of the [Prometheus operator](https://github.com/prometheus-operator/prometheus-operator), a popular way of running Prometheus in your cluster, "the Target Allocator can also pull those service monitors and pop monitors and update the monitors and scrape configurations to do that." Jacob's team doesn't run any Prometheus instances -- they just have the collector running the Prometheus receiver and sending the data off to Lightstep. "It is nice," he says. His team used to run a Prometheus sidecar, which ran as part of their Prometheus installation. This would then sit on the same pod as their Prometheus instance and read the write-ahead log that Prometheus has for persistence and batching. However, if your Prometheus instance is noisy, it can be inefficient. "It can get really noisy and not the best," says Jacob. "The collector is the best way to run this." ### The Collector setup Jacob's team runs a lot of different types of Collectors over at Lightstep. "We run metrics things, tracing things, internal ones, external ones – there’s a lot of different collectors that are running at all times", he shares. "It’s all very in-flux." They're changing things around a lot to run experiments, since the best way for them to create features for customers and end users is to make sure they work internally first. "We're running in a single path where there could be two collectors in two environments that could be running two different images and two different versions. It gets really meta and really confusing to talk about," he says. "And then, if you’re sending Collector A across an environment to Collector B, Collector B also emits telemetry about itself, which is then collected by Collector C, so it just chains." In a nutshell, you need to make sure that the collector is actually working. "That’s like the problem when we’re debugging this stuff. When there’s a problem you have to think up where the problem actually is -- is it in how we collect the data, is it in how we emit the data, is it in the source of how the data was generated? One of a bunch of things." ### Kubernetes modes on OTel The OTel Operator supports four [deployment modes](https://github.com/open-telemetry/opentelemetry-operator/blob/f6b0d947a4c48444a0483b3b0dcaf1e60c4458d6/docs/api/opentelemetrycollectors.md?from_branch=main) for the OTel Collector in Kubernetes: - [Deployment](https://kubernetes.io/docs/concepts/workloads/controllers/deployment/) - see example [ingress/00-install.yaml](https://github.com/open-telemetry/opentelemetry-operator/blob/107d2c31a61f1cea3a1d6b21241c5fee7ff79f41/tests/e2e/ingress/00-install.yaml?from_branch=main) - [DaemonSet](https://kubernetes.io/docs/concepts/workloads/controllers/daemonset/) - see example [daemonset-features/01-install.yaml](https://github.com/open-telemetry/opentelemetry-operator/blob/f6b0d947a4c48444a0483b3b0dcaf1e60c4458d6/tests/e2e/daemonset-features/01-install.yaml?from_branch=main) - [StatefulSet](https://kubernetes.io/docs/concepts/workloads/controllers/statefulset/) - see example [smoke-statefulset/00-install.yaml](https://github.com/open-telemetry/opentelemetry-operator/blob/6d2f18b0ac0303aff2b904c2de76296cea60fbf9/tests/e2e/smoke-statefulset/00-install.yaml?from_branch=main) - [Sidecar](https://www.techtarget.com/searchapparchitecture/tip/The-reasons-to-use-or-not-use-sidecars-in-Kubernetes) - see example [instrumentation-python/00-install-collector.yaml](https://github.com/open-telemetry/opentelemetry-operator/blob/cd1d136a539820a87bbc26fa2d8ff1fb821bbcf1/tests/e2e/instrumentation-python/00-install-collector.yaml) Which ones you should use depends on what you need to do, such as how you like to run applications for reliability. "Sidecar is the one we use the least and is probably used the least across the industry if I had to make a bet," Jacob says. "They’re expensive. If you don’t really need them, then you shouldn’t use them." An example of something run as a sidecar is Istio, "which makes a lot of sense to run as a sidecar because it does proxy traffic and it hooks into your container network to change how it all does its thing." You will get a cost hit if you sidecar your Collectors for all your services, and you also have limited capabilities. He says, "If you’re making Kubernetes APIs calls or attribute enrichment, that’s the thing that would get exponentially expensive if you’re running as a sidecar." He shares an example: "...if you have sidecar [Collector using the [k8sattributesprocessor](https://github.com/open-telemetry/opentelemetry-collector-contrib/tree/635d4254a3018eb3ca8f1736e71fcb54f8ed6e5a/processor/k8sattributesprocessor?from_branch=main)] on 10k pods, then that’s 10k API calls made to the K8s API. That's expensive." On the other hand, if you have five pods deployed on StatefulSets, "that's not that expensive." When you run in StatefulSet mode, you get an exact number of replicas that should exist at all times, each with a predictable name -- which is "a really valuable thing when you want consistent IDs." Due to the consistent IDs, you can do some extra work with the Target Allocator, which is why it's required. Another thing that StatefulSets guarantee is something called in-place deployment, which is also available with DaemonSets; this is where you take the pod down before you create a new one. "In a deployment you usually do a 1-up, 1-down, or what’s called a [rolling deployment](https://www.techtarget.com/searchitoperations/definition/rolling-deployment), or rolling update," Jacob says. If you were doing this with the Target Allocator, you are likely to get much more unreliable scrapes. This is because you have to redistribute all the targets when a new replica comes up, because the hash ring you place these on has changed, requiring a recalculation of all the hashes you've assigned. Whereas with StatefulSets, this isn't necessary, since you get a consistent ID range. "So when you do 1-down 1 up, it keeps the same targets each time. So like a placeholder for it – you don’t have to recalculate the ring," he explains. He notes that this is really only useful as a metrics use case, where you're scraping Prometheus. He notes that they'd probably run it as a Deployment for anything else, since that mode gives you most everything you would need. Collectors are usually stateless, so there is no need for them to hold on to anything, and Deployments are leaner as a result. "You can just run and roll out and everyone’s happy," he says. "That’s how we run most of our collectors, is just as a Deployment." For per-node scraping, DaemonSets come in handy. "This allows you to scrape the kubelet that’s run on every node, it allows you to scrape the node exporter that’s also run on every node, which is another Prometheus daemonset that most people run," he explains. DaemonSets are useful for scaling out, since they guarantee that you've got pods running on every node that matches its selector. "If you have a cluster of 800+ nodes, it’s more reliable to run a bunch of little collectors that get those tiny metrics, rather than a few bigger stateful set pods because your blast radius is much lower," he says. "If one pod goes down, you lose just a tiny bit of data, but remember, with all this cardinality stuff, that’s a lot of memory. So if you’re doing a StatefulSet, scraping all these nodes, that’s a lot of targets, that’s a lot of memory, it can go down much more easily and you can lose more data." If a Collector goes down, it comes back up quickly, since it is usually stateless, which means "usually the blip is low," says Jacob. However, if you're past the point of saturation, the blip "is more flappy, where it could go up and down pretty quickly." Thus, it's a good idea to have a horizontal pod autoscaler, or HPA. This is useful from a metrics standpoint, but you could also do it for tracing using tracing workloads. Since it's all push-based, they are much easier to scale on, and you can distribute targets and load-balance. "Pull-based is like the reason that Prometheus is so ubiquitous... because it makes local development really easy, where you can just scrape your local endpoint, that’s what most backend development is anyway," he says. "You can hit endpoint A and then hit your metrics endpoint. Then hit endpoint A again and then metrics endpoint, and check that, so it’s an easy developer loop. It also means you don’t have to reach outside of the network so if you have really strict proxy requirements to send data, local dev is much easier for that. That's why OTel now has a really good Prometheus exporter, so it can do both." ### The centralized OTel Collector gateway There is a [centralized gateway](/docs/collector/deploy/gateway/) in-flight, which is part of the Collector chain Jacob mentioned earlier. The effort is centered around [Arrow](https://arrow.apache.org/). Lightstep has done some work around improving "the processing speed and ingress costs of OTel data by using Apache Arrow, which is a project for columnar-based data representations," Jacob explains. They are currently doing some proof of implementation to investigate its performance, and to confirm that things work as expected. ### Keeping telemetry up-to-date Jacob notes that is it important to keep your telemetry up-to-date, since library authors and maintainers are always working on new performance features and improvements to the software. "It makes migration easy as well. Trying to migrate from an early version of something to the latest version of something, you miss a lot of breaking changes potentially, and you have to be careful of that," he says. He recommends using Dependabot, which they use in OTel. OTel packages update in lockstep, which means you have to update "a fair amount of packages at once, but it does do it all for you, which is nice," he says. However, you should be doing this with all your dependencies, as "CVEs happen in the industry constantly. If you're not staying up to date with vulnerability fixes then you’re opening yourself up to security attacks, which you don’t want. 'Do something about it' is my recommendation." ## Additional Resources - Catch this conversation in full on the [OTel YouTube Channel](https://youtu.be/dpXhgZL9tzU) - To learn more about the OTel Operator, reach out on [CNCF Slack](https://communityinviter.com/apps/cloud-native/cncf) in the [#OTel-operator channel](https://cloud-native.slack.com/archives/C033BJ8BASU) - Jacob will be back to speak with the End User Working Group at [OTel in Practice](/community/end-user/otel-in-practice/) on _August 17th at 13:00 ET/10:00 PT_. Be sure to [mark your calendars](https://shorturl.at/cIJT2)! ## Final Thoughts OpenTelemetry is all about community, and we wouldn’t be where we are without our contributors, maintainers, and users. We value user feedback -- please share your experiences and help us improve OpenTelemetry. Here's how to connect with us: - The [#otel-endusers channel](/community/end-user/slack-channel/) on the [CNCF Community Slack](https://communityinviter.com/apps/cloud-native/cncf) - Monthly [End Users Discussion Group meetings](/community/end-user/discussion-group/) - [OTel in Practice sessions](/community/end-user/otel-in-practice/) - [Monthly interview/feedback sessions](/community/end-user/interviews-feedback/) - [OpenTelemetry on LinkedIn](https://www.linkedin.com/groups/14081251) - [OpenTelemetry blog](https://github.com/open-telemetry/opentelemetry.io/blob/368f811f81c27798a031b4c92024ecdd65cddc19/README.md?from_branch=main#submitting-a-blog-post) Be sure to follow OpenTelemetry on [Mastodon](https://fosstodon.org/@opentelemetry) and [X](https://x.com/opentelemetry), previously known as Twitter, and share your stories using the **#OpenTelemetry** hashtag!